41 thoughts on “The Nuke Deal : Does India’s democratic system not allow great leadership ?”

1. I have no doubt that Manmohan Singh is destiny’s chosen man for India for the last few years, in fact ever since he was chosen the Finance Minister by PM Narsimhan Rao. And he is doing his best not only on Nuclear treaty but in general as well. Where there will be work done there will be problems.

2. Anybody know more about or have personal experience with the Professionals Party of India (at least more than what’s on their website @ http://www.professionalspartyofindia.com )?
   They have an event posted on their site for July 11th in Pune — anybody in this community willing & able to attend and share insights about this organization?

3. Indian by Birth and Canadian by Choice.
   Growing up in a boarding school in India (13yrs – 18yrs) laid great amount of expected discipline for when I would return to Bombay.
   I guess returning to Bombay (1999) only burst my expected notion of discipline in our society.
   Personally I do not believe in the Indian Political System for the very same reason being why we still wonder which came first the egg or the chicken.

4. But then, it is not something about his personal life to go by his instincts and beliefs. It is a matter of national interest. You cannot simplify the thing by saying that “it’s what he believes in.”
   Narendra Modi believed in ethnic cleansing and used the pogrom as his means to achieve that. He must be having his reasons to believe that muslims are outsiders and to be shown the door. But that does not really mean that you and I can sit back and nod our heads in appreciation of his courage to go ahead with what he believes in.
   It’s a flawed logic, Shekharji. Personalities above politics. Kalam was the first; now, it is Dr Singh. I’m sure a few years from now, what really made him such a strong believer.

5. It seems that the firm decision about the nuclear deal might be one of the very few progressive decisions of the UPA government..even so, we do not know the nature of the fine-print that might be played to the advantage of the US as the current US administration is far from being a selfless missionary.
   All we hear about in favour of the N. Deal is that India needs alternative sources of power. Well, is this the only and the best way to achieve that? Maybe, maybe not..we’ll never know.
   Regardless of the dynamics of the nuclear deal, one thing for certain is that the UPA govt needs to be taken out. Just looking at the group of ministers forming the alliance should appeal to the sensibilities of any semi-rational person..Ram Vilas Paswan, Shibu Soren (convicted of murder), Laloo Prasad, Karunanidhi, Sharad Pawar, JK PDP (proxy for Pak ISI)….these guys are some of the most corrupted and illiterate leaders, probably second only to the primitives from Taliban, not to mention the Leftist Communists who have been black-mailing the Congress throughout their reign. The UPA has failed in all major streams, and the progress of India is borne in majority by the IT and outsourcing industry.
   Now with the Left pulling out, it has come down to a mere circus act with small parties with 2-3 MPs demanding all kinds of things in return for their support to the UPA. How can such a cheap government take India forward in the technology age?
   What India needs is a strong nationalist leader from the BJP..most of the leaders of the BJP come from the higher, educated classes of India as opposed to the UPA leaders who are illiterate buffoons who have only learnt the art of playing vote-bank quota system politics to the extreme. Its amazing how these guys have covered themselves up so well under the banner of Secularism..if the saying “wolf in sheep’s skin” fits anyone perfectly it is them.
   Nehru, Gandhiji, etc. were leaders of the past who fulfilled their destinies as per the needs of that time, and the whole of India was in a passionate mood then, so it cannot be attributed singularly to any of the leaders. The Britishers came, looted India with their divide and conquer strategy, and once India became a burden, they packed up and left the mess that is still in its infancy of recovery..we give too much credit to the Indian freedom movement..none of the freedom fighters would have lasted in, say the 1700s when the Britishers had just started cashing in, or under the rule of someone like say Mugabe from Zimbabwe. It is all a timed design.
   Anyhow, it would be clear to any semi-intelligent person that Manmohan Singh was a perfect puppet for the Sonia Gandhi honchos with his mild nature..he is more of an accountant than a leader. Indians have the virus of dynastic rule patterns from the past coupled with a “brown sahib” syndrome, which is why someone like Sonia Gandhi, who was a waitress in Italy without any sufficient credentials in administration or education, has been placed in the position of such power.
   India HAS to choose the proper leaders (preferably from the BJP).

6. As for the suggestion of having the leader of Infosys as the minister of IT and such, the BJP govt in Karnataka is already making strides in this direction by wooing Narayana Murthi of Infosys to play a major role in governance there..while the goonda raj of Deve Gowda had been a big hurdle for the Infosys leader.

7. He is one of few leader who are ahead of the game.
   same during 90s to opening up economy, same left parties were against that decision. then Mr. Singh (& team) pushed thru reforms which resulted in best decade for indian economy.
   althou all those decision seems to be obvious and correct moves for future, don’t understand why it takes some years for them to understand.! left parties are considered to have intellectuals, educated leaders.

8. Sir,
   We have no choice but to agree with you. Nuclear Deal decision by the PM Dr.ManMohan Singh is definitely a bold and courageous decision. He has risen above his Finance background and proved that he can take International decisions too.
   Leaders are born and not made. Who knew better than Chanakya.
   We see great leadership at regional levels in a democratic system of India. But when these very leaders are asked to represent India as a leader somehow the regional bias in them takes away the courage.
   There are some very special needs of Indian society. Unity in Diversity. What do you expect of a leader in the Parliament when he can hardly converse with the regional representatives who can either understand Hindi or English may be none.
   In the times of Nehru I believe he had an advantage since the people who joined the parliament were mostly known to him and belonged from the same party.
   I wonder how the Congress coiterie is away from the decision and not hogging the lime light fearing the election backlash. What if this turban PM fails? They can always go back to the people and blame him for his personal failure.
   I raise a point here that if a Leader is not respected by his own party men for leadership how do we expect him to gain respect from the nation? he was chosen to represent a minority government. Will he be chosen if Congress ever gets 2/3 rd Majority? We all know who will represent then…
   I beleive Sir you are hinting of a Presidential form of government where then each ministry can be represented by experts in their own field under the leadership.
   My concern who will take care of the reservation policy, Quota regime and system. Someday you will have a reserved category President. We see the conditions of the divided mindset at the state level Chief Minister Leadership. Maharashtra is itself facing a unique example of divided leadership lately.
   Laloo Prasad yadav is a unique example to mention who did bring Indian railways to Profit on Paper the least.
   The Political Will of a humble farmer from a small village gets lost no sooner he joins the main stream Ocean like the small rivers loose their identities when they reach their ends.
   I think people in the Media like your selves and all news agencies who are not biased by their regional partners will and should play a larger than life role to form an opinion in a multi diverse nation like ours.
   You made the film Phoolan Devi (The Bandit Queen) and people learnt what actually had happened. Times have changed now. So many TV channels and with so many screens it is much easier now.
   Leadership and Courage is what we need.
   Vinod Agarwal – Aspiring Motion Pictures Producer.

9. @ abhi,
   MODI IS WHAT INDIA NEEDS:
   While you conveniently label Modi as some kind of an extremist from your pseudo-secular mindset, you seem to be oblivious to the fact that quite a few Hindu men, women and children were burnt alive in Godhra which triggered the Gujarat riots..if something like this had happened in an Islamic country, can you imagine the consequences? Hindus are extremely tolerant, but I think their limits were being reached at that point, and are still being constantly tested by the pseduo-secular UPA and allies whose main agenda seems to be to attack the foundation of Hinduism mostly that of the affluent classes.
   What is the UPA composed of? It is composed of A) Pseudo-secular, pseduo-intellectual Hindus with low self-esteem, B) fanatic leaders of minority religions and C) corrupt Dalit leaders who just want to make money by creating these divides and quotas. You have to be really dumb to not notice the complete failure and abuse of the quota systems. Even the IITs and IIMs, the pinnacles of the Indian education system, are being forced to induct incompetent students.
   And do you have no concern for the lakhs of Kashmiri Pandits who have been ethnically cleansed from Kashmir? I have met many of them who come to tears when talking about their Kashmir..decent, sophisticated, prosperous people who were forced to sell their houses and businesses for pennies and leave Kashmir or die. One has to be brain-dead to not see what is going on in Kashmir..for over 3000 yrs it had been a Hindu-dominated place..not only the Kashmiri Pandits, but a large number of other Hindu Brahmins can trace their lineage back to Kashmir..all have been victims of foreign invasions, the latest being from the Pak ISI operating on a simple formula, use terrorism to ethnically cleanse the land off Hindus, put as many Muslims in, play the numbers game with the Separatist Independence movement (through PDP etc.) which would seem like some holy acceptable ideal to the world, and then annex the land with a majority vote. And all this with the blessings of the pseudo-secular Indians..keep in mind that your ignorance directly affects the lives of the Indians at the receiving end.
   Modi has tremendous support from the NRI community and a growing number of Indians, because he seems to have a great balance of mind where he’s not utterly fanatic like some of the other Hindu leaders. He seems to have a good talent for honest, sophisticated leadership and a deep absorption of how to embed the liberal values of Hinduism into the Indian society. This will be the ONLY way for India’s progress. Modi is a tremendous power, and as such, the corrupt leaders from UPA with the help of media are constantly tainting his image, because they know that if he comes to power, their time of corruption is up.

10. I agree with you, there is paucity of good leadership, who can take stand above party lines and stake every thing for country’s benefit.
    Whenever, any calamity strikes India, the film fraternity rise up in defense.
    Film Faternity has a good following in India, they should take the responsibility of educating the masses about the benefits of nuke deal both pros and cons. Let there be healthy dialogue between Dilip Kumarji, Dev Anandji to represent mature generation and Amir Khan and Amitabh Bachan as the current icon to air their views. There views will be watched seriously by the millions of Indians. We are fed up watching the Bardhans, Yechuries, Lallus, Moilies. oh God !Please give us a break.

11. Excuse me, Brahmastra. But please, please do not tell me that India needs Modi. India cannot afford to have such bigots as its leaders. Modi is a fanatic, to use a milder term, that is. To answer your comments:
    We still do not know what happened, what provoked, and who instigated the terrorist act of setting fire the train in Godhra. We still do not know. And even if you come and tell me you have evidence to prove that it was done by Muslims, well, I would think twice before I generalize and say, all Muslims in India should be punished for that. How do you hold the entire community accountable for the deeds of a few antisocial elements in that community? By the logic that you seem to be going by, would you agree that all Hindus are responsible for the actions of the shivsainiks who carried out the riots in Mumbai? For the actions of those karsevaks who demolished Babri Masjid? For burning missionaries? And, above all, for the most heinous of crimes committed by Modi’s men in Gujarath? And, would you justify the anti-sikh riots following the assassination of Indira Gandhi? When I point fingers at Modi and his men, in no way do I implicate the entire Hindu community. I do not believe that VHP, RSS, or the numerous other Sangh outfits represent Hindus. A majority are still out of that net. But the Sangh and their people are trying hard to create the “muslim other” and to divide the society in communal line. Unfortunately, to add fuel to this fire, we have this band of Muslim extremists whose acts of terrorism, in fact, help the Hindu rightwingers and act as a catalyst in creating the divide.
    And, about that if this had happened in an Islamic country part, dude, this is not an Islamic Country, this is not a Hindu country, either. India is a secular republic with its laws, lawmakers, and law enforcing agencies. If people start taking laws into their hands, it won’t be too long before we move to a state of anarchy. Would you really want that to happen? No, it won’t be just a Hindu anarchy. All of us, including the ‘pseudo-secularists’, have a right to be anarchists.
    Please do not tell me about Hindus being so tolerant. Don’t you forget our (read Hindu) history of oppressing people based on their birth and caste.Since when have we all become Hindus? We are Brahmins, Vysayas, Sudras, and Dalits, and then yes, Hindus, by some defintion. The Hindu identities are essentially caste identities. The appropriation of communities, Gods, and customs to the larger defintion of Hindu has been one fuelled by the numbers game in a democratic setup.
    Failure and abuse of quota system? sorry, I have no reason to believe that it has failed. Of course, you cannot expect their lives to change overnight. After hundreds of years of suppression and oppression and denial of opportunities, they are finally coming to the mainstream. And that needs the support of government, of society, of people like you and me. I can write on and on about how someone’s intellectual abilities shape up, but I’m sure you know that too.
    Then, about Kashmiri pandits. Well, I do share your sentiments for them, I know many Kashmiri pandits, and have discussed their issues with them a few times. But then, you know how our Governments from time to time mismanaged the Kashmir issue and alienated the Kashmiri people from our country. Despite Kashmir being a disputed land since the time of our independence, the migration of Pandits started only by the late eighties. In fact many of them were government-sponsored relocations. Yes, I know Congress cannot wash off their hands; those knicker-wallahs in COngress also had contributed their bit in making a total mess of the situation.
    And, about Modi’s popularity among NRIs, well, we know from where VHP is getting its funds. the neo-convert enthusiasm of NRIs in religious matters are well known; for them, it is one way of reclaiming an identity. They thinking Modi is the best is in no way an acquittal for him. And, I do not quite believe in this, development at any cost slogan. For me, it is not just money and development that matter. My society and its values (pluralistic and inclusive) do matter to me. I cannot compromise with the likes of Modi who has so frighteningly polarised a state’s electorate in communal lines as like as Bush and his ‘you are either with us or against us’ binary logic.

12. Brahmastra,
    We surely dont need Hindu Nazis like you. Can you please shut your racist mouth and rot in your little world? Shekharji, are you going to allow such hate mongers in this forum?
    This joker is spreading poison and furthering his hindutav agenda through his intellectually challenged arguments.

13. Abhi,
    I appreciate your articulate and whole-hearted beliefs. I’ll respond to your points in more detail later.
    Raj (if that really is your name),
    Your post clearly reflects the lack of a peaceful, secular nature that you so vainly try to portray of yourself..confused closet fanatics like you are an added (if not the main) cause of India’s instability.
    Hindutva is real secularism and the best collective set of beliefs for India, or at least for the majority and the leadership. Confused, semi-intellectuals like you will not understand the depth of this.
    Whilst the world is plagued by the violence, fanaticism and expansionist ideals of other religions that do deliver the goal of God-realization or Unity Consciousness, Hinduism, in its various forms, is providing solace to a growing number of earnest seekers. Even the great illumined ones such as Sri Sri Ravi Shankar are now openly showing support for the BJP by attending functions of BJP leaders. It is time that the Indian Hindus start realising what real secularism is and recognize the deceiptful and self-destructive agenda of the illiterate buffoons from the UPA.

14. Abhi,
    You are mixing a lot of issues together. The anti-sikh riots are in a completely different context than the Gujarat riots. The anti-sikh riots were actually triggered by your beloved Congress amidst justifying statements from Rajiv Gandhi as “When a tree falls, the earth shakes”. Now, those riots I really do condemn. I think one also cannot deny the hand of extremists in creating a rift between Sikhs and Hindus..which is even in play today.
    Have you spent any honest effort in knowing the facts of the Gujarat riots? Please do so. The media has done a great job of branding Modi as some kind of a fanatic. The facts are very different. Since 1947, the Gujarat riots are the only ones where more than 200 Hindu rioters were shot by cops. 18600 villages, 240 municipal towns and 25 districts, the number of locations that were affected by riots was just 60. Not a single man-day was lost in the 200 odd industrial
    townships by any industry in Gujarat because of the riots. The examinations in schools, colleges and universities were conducted as per schedule during the period of riots. Please research more about the facts..
    If you want to know what genocide is try finding out what happened to over 50,000 Kashmiri pundits who have been killed when 4 lakh of them have been driven out of Kashmir. In four days the Congress led government killed 3000 sikhs in the sikh riots after the death of Indira Gandhi.
    About the Mumbai riots, I don’t know if you have ever lived in Mumbai..I am a product of Mumbai, and I will say that the Shiv Sena have been a great balancing act for the fanatic and anti-national sections of Muslims there..before the Babri riots, we would openly see lower-class muslim areas bursting firecrackers when Pakistan won any matches, even against India..this, in itself is not the issue, but you needed to live there to experience the growing anti-national sentiment.
    Islam, as it is widely practiced today, is an expansionist religion..sooner you accept this, the better it is for India and the world as a whole. It has become the most corrupt religion which has lost most of its spirituality along the way and has turned into a violent political tool. True Islam is not in practice much.
    Every human has a basic sense of unity, but that unity is increasingly being overshadowed by the fanatic propaganda of extremist leaders..and this is a lot more evident in the newer organised religions.
    There is no definition for Hinduism, and that is why it is not a religion. But fanatics from other religions openly attack the major belief systems of Hinduism because of their fear. What kind of a person are you? Of late, even the existence of Rama was subjected to question by the UPA along with the shameless attempt to destroy the Ram Sethu. How can you pseuo-secular people just stand by without any respect for the majority? There is solid evidence of events from the Ramayana and Mahabharata all over India..the UPA govt could have had some respect to put money into scientifically researching the archaeological aspects of this first. India is a treasure mine for archaeology, and if proper funds are channeled in that direction, it can make innumerable breakthroughs in all streams….even alternative fuel.
    Caste System was quite sound in its unadulterated form, but human life is prone to corruption. Even then, it seems that this issue of oppression of lower castes are often exaggerated way out of balance to incite aggression among the lower castes. Direct quotas are extremely short-sighted strategies by buffoon leaders who want instant-gratification in the form of votes. If they really wanted the benefit of the “underpriveleged”, they would make themselves less monetarily corrupt, and channel money into offering benefits and tuition fee exemptions to the low-income groups as is done in the USA. How can you ever justify a guy who scored 60% getting admission over someone who scored 90%? It is such a wasteful process.
    And when was the last time you checked the bank balance of your great Dalit leaders and supporters of quotas such as Laloo Prasad, Ram Vilas Paswan, Amar Singh and Mayawati?
    Thanks for your reluctant sentiments about the Kashmiri Pandits.
    As far as the NRIs are concerned, they are increasingly returning back to their roots after seeing the horrors of materialistic modernisation caused from a lack of spiritual values. Indians who are obsessed with the glamour of modernisation have not yet felt the sting of it in full force as it is in some of the “developed” countries. Even living in huts and riding packed trains can be considered a blessing in comparison. I will tell you right now that, on a collective level, a Vedic-inspired society in India is the only hope for world peace.

15. Oh my God..what a discussion going on!!! Abhi, thanks for your befitting reply to this brahmastra or I should say brahmkhatra..lol
    I think this guy ( whom my dear Raj very appropriately called a joker),ideally, should be banned from this forum. But even if not banned by gentle Shekhar, I , anyways, now find his ideas so ludicrous ( straight from ekta kapoor’s mahabharat I guess..lol) that rather than arguing with him , I just wanna laugh at him & ignore him.
    You surely rock brahmastra..lol

16. dev,
    I thought you found a tree full of bananas and had gone bye bye. Call me a joker eh? i’ll turn you into a frog..i have superpowers as well. Just indulging you at your level.

17. Shekhar lets put in perspective – India needs sanity and that is coming from 1 human may not be possible?

18. My dear shekhar,
    I believe you are writing this post from new york.I can never approve of what you have written down as a responsible indian citizen.i respect you as a great filmmaker who directed films like “bandit Queen” and ‘The four feathers”.but i cant agree with you in this case.
    Man mohan singh is not doing what he believes in.He is doing what they beleive in. To my reading of indian politics, i strongly belive that there is a strong group in congress who are making billions out of a great conspiracy which is yet to be publicized.They are in a mission. A mission which will cuturally and literally will colonialise india to United States.
    When India has signed the first step of Nuke deal, an american ship which drains nuclear wastage reached in chennai to drain the wastes.As a very well-informed film maker , you know what that nuclear waste will do to the sea and the people living near there.this happens when they only signed the first step of the deal.Why they have to drain it in a indian sea…?
    Why they made it an ‘HIDE-ACT’….?..If all things are for the good sake of India,why should they hide it to the opposition parties and their own allie CPM..?…
    One thing is clear.Indian cinema is now in the hands of cultural terrorists such as Yash chopra and karan johar. Their intention behind making every movie with aggressive western culture is not that good.People will imitate what their fav actors do..So when a majority of people think it in an american way, the land becomes an extension of america.So these slaves will obey whatever US want them to obey.Even in our metros, people are very much imperialised.. they wont make a ‘Aaahh…ayyo”, even though a snake bites them..they will make an ‘Ouch..” instead of that. Originality is loosing from indians. Whenever they hear a surprise news they make a sound “OOps..” why they are making this sound even though they know its not their own.Because they respect anything western. They think anything which is indian is second graded.Is for this country, Bhagath singh,Netaji subhash chandra bose,raj guru fought and died…?….

19. Hi Shekhar,
    Its been a long time since I wrote on your blog. I hope you’ve been doing well in whatever you’ve been busy with !
    I only want to say 2 things. Your comparison of nehru as someone who elicited respect of the opposition is flawed.
    For , In nehru’s time , there was NO opposition ! It was the Dirty Chacha all the way – not only into the PM’s chair election after election , but also into many women’s underpants !
    He was a liability to the nascent nation and due to him , India lags where it should have been far ahead by now . His legacy is Dynastic politics , and a Non-existant Defence policy.
    The other thing I dont agree with you is your gloating praise of Manmohan Singh. He is a pawn of the Nehru-god-knows-who- masquerading-as-Gandhi family.
    This turbaned stooge is another great Liability to the nation. One of his children works in the US government , he cannot move a finger without Sonia’s approval. He is infact the non-person , a mask for the Un-constitutional power bloc of the Gandhi Cabal.
    I dread to imagine what information he lends to Sonai and her Italian/KGB interlocutors while the ‘intelligentia’ sleeps on , thinking we have an intellectual at the helm.
    Rest Assured , Manmohan’s convictions are non existant – he is just dancing to the American tune . I am not a Commie – but I oppose the Nuclear deal – this is the single biggest threat to india after the Chinese incursion of 1962.
    we will regret it 50 years from now – if we inked it.

20. Hi Sir
    I just could not understand what are u talking about here? Its about our political system, or energy that we need for socalled growth(but without estimating the outcome) or the efficient technocrats ?
    I could not make out anything from ur article because didnt want to believe that u have written this piece.
    Do we need that much energy? Then whats wrong if more than 50 dams are being planned to build on our very own the Ganga, which feeds nearly 50 percent of India…..that is also for energy..
    Democracy is very a garrulous system …. Whats wrong in being what one is.
    If Sam Manekshaw would have opted for a coup perhaps it would have been a failed attempt, because by that time people wanted everything in their hand. They were dissatisfied and desperate but not hopeless …and they had variety of leaders to look upto .. be it JP or Charu Majumdar.
    Today a Modi can go on rampage in Gujarat and in late 60’s it was the Youth of Gujarat who came forward first to ask for their share in the system.
    Do we really need a scholar or an expert to run a system ….. I seriously disagree with it… For millenia our mothers have run the most complicated system ‘family’ without … and no institution teaches that .. A 10th pass lady of Manipur …. Irom Sharmila Chanu can lead her generation …. and a briefless lawyer ‘Mohandas’ can become Gandhi.
    U want Mr Murthy to become IT minister … what would he do … creat a bigger Visa crisis what he did in the past… The nations integrity was challanged by a series of Scams when an economist Manmohan Singh was our Finance Minister. A Qualified Doctor Aambumani Ramdoss can create a Venugopal no one knew earlier.
    Offcourse a great nation should take great decisions but this way ??? Just not acceptable
    Regards
    I am desperatey waiting for ur view on the issue of relation between Inflation and Black Money.. My story is almost ready and am holding it till u respond.

21. Brahmastra
    read your argument. You are presentin some data, claiming that they are facts.I am not doubting their authenticity, but they really talk about problems.But what is the solution? Hindutva?Will it not perpetuate the problem? It is like this:
    you are saying..They have been doing all this crap which is why we are going to dogs. Hence we should also do more crappy things to give a fitting reply to all that crap.
    The problem is not who is doing it or why or how much? The problem is ‘Crap is filling up here’, in deeds, through minds. Address that first.
    You see a vedic society as solution.Nice to hear, but mind you,wherever there is a monopolization of anything, there is always a conflict.If so,how can any monopoly become a solution?You want it to be the effect. I say it would become the cause.Does it better India in anyway?
    today u will drive away all muslims(Suppose, although i dont support it) and 2mrw India will be full of Hindus.Do you think peace will still previal.The next disharmony will be on caste lines.People will begin to fight with same aggression,for caste or sect.that will continue for another 500 years and then some soul like you will again say ‘Drive away the brahmins or backward castes or whatever’.Then..subsects..the larger picture is..Disintegration.Is it of any use?Think.

22. Hi Aakarsh,
    What you are saying is very sound in a modern logical perspective.
    Firstly, i would like to say that i am not at all proposing “driving away all the muslims”..rather i was suggesting instilling some organised framework into government..and in context to this, i will say that the vedic framework for government is unparalleled.
    Secondly, you have to remove the massively accepted stereotyping of hinduism as a kind of religion that is comparable to modern organised revelationary religions. Hinduism is in a league of its own.
    At this point, all i am saying is india, and the world as a whole, needs to be awakened to the deeper levels of existence and universal design, or higher truths, if you would. Yes, caste system got corrupted and may not be applicable anymore..but we have to set some kind of qualifications for ministers and other government officials.
    Caste system is not as significant as the other streams of ancient Vedic wisdom. For example, the modern religions do not accept reincarnation, and are extremely foreign to the ultimate truth of “Aham Brahmasmi” and various other higher truths that are only emphasized in Hinduism. So, the collective wisdom and consciousness of India needs to upgraded through Hinduism and vedic stuff. This is solving the problem at the root level, which is the only way to solve it. Corruption, etc. etc. will only go away if you address the deeper levels of consciousness and loosen the grip of materialism and confused fear-mongering religions.
    If you understand the depth of what i am saying here, you will realise that it is far above the petty hindu-muslim communal strife..however, you have to realise that the followers of lower-level religions, out of their ignorance, develop a fear towards higher truths because they have to let go of their older patterns..this is another substantial reason for general fanaticism.

23. Aakarsh,
    But you do bring up some excellent points. I am not one who believes in a perfect Utopian society, and things do get screwed up somewhere along the line..my proposal is only one of “bettering” the Indian society from the mess it is now on account of illiterate donkeys having taken over the reigns…we need true sophisticated Hindu leaders like Gandhiji…but people like Advani, Modi, etc. are a good second option.

24. I agree with you Sir, and I highly appreciate you for what you have said. Also read, my current post on Indian Politicians. I have also put a link to your post in my blog.

25. Shekhar:
    Good topic and great discussion!
    Democracy, unfortunately, has come to be known as a consensual running of Government. I believe it is a wrong interpretation. For, the Government must be chosen by a majority. But once a party/coalition gets a majority, then that party has full right to act and make laws on the behalf of the country! The opposition can question them, the judiciary can bring them to court (suo moto, if needed) for something totally out of the ordinary – but to expect that every one (even the losers in the elections) should have a right to be on the decision table is ludicrous!
    In your article, I almost feel as if you want an Army takeover. I can feel our frustration with the system from all sides – so am I.
    I feel that Indian system of Governance needs to change – and it will as we move on. When there seems no hope of any leadership, its only then that someone can show leadership.
    Regarding the debate about Modi. For the life of me, I have never understood the difference between his sin and Rajiv Gandhi’s during 1984 Sikh killings or Buddhadeb Das Gupta in Nandigram or Laloo Prasad Yadav for last two decades when Bihar was a mayhem.
    At the very least Modi’s administration has delivered results! He knows what his administration duty is and he is fulfilling it.
    And besides he is an ELECTED Chief Minister. So, although outsiders from gujarat may cry hoarse, they can’t do a thing if they remain within our democracy. Its quite another thing that those who talk of liberty, freedom of speech and human rights are the leftist of India – EXACTLY the people who trample these rights on a daily basis. Communism is BUILT on trampling these virtues and Nandigram has brought it out in the open!
    So, its basically Henry Ford style Democracy “You can have any car until it is black” – “You can have any elected leader until WE approve of him”! Plain sickening!
    -desh
    drishtikone.com

26. Your point on the ministers based on IT and military was excellent. These ministers do consult the experts, so its like a win-win situation. The ministers get to do vote bank politics and these professionals advice them on what to do. That’s the system in Karnataka, which led to Bangalore becoming the IT Hub. Narayan Murthy played an important part in it.

27. @Desh
    In India, if BJP or the Sangh can divide the voters in communal lines like what they did in Gujarat, they can win hands down. It’s simple arithmetic, and an inherent weakness of the democratic system. That is something we have to live with, and that is why we need to keep people aware of the perils of the communalisation of politics. So, Modi being an elected CM doesn’t really hold good for an argument. Indira Gandhi — her party, rather– had the majority when they enforced emergency. The protests against the emergency and other elected governments from time to time were not uncalled for or unprecedented. It’s a continuous process, the people have a right to protest and show dissent. So, we keep campaigning against Modi, his brand of politics, and other issues that we have a different view on. Democratically, that is.
    About the government having the mandate to run the government the way they like: well, the government can run the government and take policy decisions and continue with the governance if they have the majority to do so; not bothering much about the protests on the streets, if they chose not to. The mandate, in a democracy, comes from the majority. In the case of the N-Deal, Congress didn’t have the majority, and as such no mandate. It was a coalition government and when the partners have different views, they will have to sit and sort it out. And like in any alliance, the partners have their right to part ways if they don’t agree on the basic principles of the alliance. And, that’s what has happened here. Now, let Congress prove their majority and go ahead with the deal. The Left can happily go back to the streets and TV shows and continue their campaign against the deal. Again, it’s democracy.
    @Prathik,
    Could you please tell me Narayan Murthy’s contributions, other than building his company, in building Bangalore as a IT hub? Just curious.

28. @abhi,
    The contributions of Sri Narayana Murthy? Forget about all the other economic growth crap claimed by politicians. This guy is single-handedly responsible for the rise of the Indian IT culture and its propagation around the world. I know first-hand the efficiency and utter sophistication with which Infosys functions, and it would put in place some of the most advanced forms of administration. However, this is also true of the other IT big wigs as Wipro and TCS.
    Do you really think that there is any contribution necessary by Narayan Murthy “other than building his company”? LOL..what audacity!
    BJP IS NOT COMMUNAL:
    How conveniently you label BJP as a communal party when, in fact, they are the most sophisticated party that India has right now. Their Karnataka win underscores this fact since Karnataka is a state of a relatively more sophisticated, cosmopolitan, “non-communal” lot than any of the other states in India, and they have understood the need for suave governance to complement their IT boom.
    I hope this trend continues. Though I’m an ardent supporter of BJP, I’d think that judging from the recent low grade pimping going on in the UPA (coupled with their shameless promotion of the amateur Rahul Gandhi on the basis of his speech in the parliament special session which seemed like something from a 5th standard elocution competition), any semi-decent person would realise that the NDA is magnitudes higher in integrity, ethics, nationalism and sophistication. Please, stop acting like “brown sahibs”..get some confidence and esteem of your roots.
    How shameful it is for Indians to support the UPA and call them “secular”..do you really think these guys are secular? They are an automatic choice for the illiterate minorities who are not capable of indepth analysis, and fall easy prey to vote-bank politics..but, at least the educated, affluent classes of India need to see the real threat of the UPA, Left, BSP etc. These guys will surely cause another major wave of brain-drain while taking India back to the stone-age. If you want to preserve the rich culture and spirituality of India while being progressive in infrastrcture, vote for the BJP!!

29. I’m sure that even Gandhiji would have also been coined as communal in today’s India because he based his entire life on the Bhagavad Gita and other high-frequency spirituality from the ocean of Hinduism. I wonder what he would have to say, as being an ardent Rama Bhakta, about the UPA’s shameless materialistic stand of destroying the Ram Sethu for a few bucks while completely undermining the beliefs of the majority?
    If you look into history, all leaders of lands have blood on their hands. How conveniently the UPA etc. have labelled Modi as some kind of a fanatic while their illiterate donkey leaders have far more blood on their hands. The buffoon Lalu Prasad keeps labelling the BJP as “communal”..this joker is one of the worst leaders of India who has actively destroyed the great state of Bihar through his divisionary politics, violence and corruption.

30. Abhi:
    “Indira Gandhi — her party, rather– had the majority when they enforced emergency.”
    I think you got that history wrong. She lost the elections after that.
    If electrorate divide-and-rule and winning from it is concerned, then we will have to start from the beginning:
    – Nehru deliberately went after the Jan Sangh and RSS knowing fully well that it was the ONLY party to compete with him. Godse’s case was the biggest case in point. There was a reason why his testimony in the court has still been held as a state secret! There was a case against Godse, but to put so many RSS people in jail for their beliefs was as much a divide and rule.
    – COmmunists have ruled Bengal for 25 years. Have you checked how? How they penetrated and simply wiped out their opposition by force/killing or simple abductions..
    What Modi did was a sin… but in my book, he is merely FOLLOWING the prevalent system that has been presented before him. It is like, if you can’t beat them.. join ’em.
    Or is it that when the one on the receiving end starts giving you your OWN medicine… suddenly it becomes a “sin”?
    You know, the political discrimination and subjugation of RSS and Jan Sangh (treatment to JP Menon and others) was a slippery slope that Nehru CHOSE to take…which Indira followed and which Rajiv Gandhi so well implemented in 1984 Sikh killings (while every “Abhi” and his brother just kept MUM and quiet) and now, it is hypocritical and facetious on part of his successors (and today’s Abhis) to turn around and say.. “Heck, this is sin-ful”! Oh really??
    -desh
    drishtikone.com

31. Let me take it one by one.
    Indian IT revolution happened because of many factors. Narayanmurthy and Infosys are just one among them. Even before Infy made it big in IT, Bangalore was identified as the IT hub in the country, and companies were setting up shop here. Some did well, thanks to their leaders who knew how to run business, and some didn’t do that well. Narayanmurthy’s contributions to Indian IT industry will start and end with that one chapter on Infosys. Period.
    Of course, I have no intention or reason to belittle his achievements as a businessman. He and his team did a commendable job in making Infosys what it is today. And, no businessman will embark on the journey without wanting to excel. They lived their dream, and at the end, we have an Infosys. Fair enough for Murthy.
    Frankly, I do not see any point in arguing with you about BJP’s communal hues. Congressmen killing Sikhs in 1984 is as evil as many of the riots orchestrated by BJP and the Sangh members. Two wrongs do not make a right in history.
    We all know Congress has all along been peddling the soft-hindutva line. There were/are enough hindutva sympathizers in that party. They tend to forget that the people are smart enough to see through. The way they handled Kashmir, and even the Babri issue –remember, Rajiv Gandhi opened the disputed site for poojas to save his face from what he did in Shahbano case. It was again a classic case of someone using two wrongs to make a right. And, many of these acts were inspired, triggered, or forced by the hindutva hardliners within and outside the party.
    When the choice is between two evils, I tend to go by the lesser evil.
    About Indira Gandhi (or Congress) losing the election after the emergency, I said ‘they’ had majority when they imposed emergency. Modi won the elections in Gujarath because the electorate was communally divided, and then, there are people (like you, should I say?) who think development is the only thing that matters. Ol’ Bob is singing,
    “How many times can a man turn his head,
    Pretending he just doesn’t see?
    The answer, my friend, is blowin’ in the wind,
    The answer is blowin’ in the wind.”
    But then, people tend to pretend blind, deaf, and dumb when hard facts are presented. And that is the tragedy of our times.

32. Abhi:
    When people behave and navigate a system, they are not clocking or taking count of rights and wrongs. They are merely looking at how the SYSTEM works and then planning their moves.
    And that is what I meant to imply.. this “lesser evil theory” is good for analysis, but in real life, calculations and actions on the ground is made on a different set of inputs.
    So, what I am saying – to be very clear to you – is that Modi is just a symptom. It could have been – and WILL be – somebody else who does it. Nandigram happened… same thing.
    Its the product of the SYSTEM that has and still allows this. This is the ONLY way it works, says the system loud and clear.
    Now, to bring Hindutva in all this is nonsensical.. as if ONE wrong is okay, and another is not.
    For that is how it has been for several years… when everyone and his/her brother in the “oh-my-heart-beats-for-religious-downtrodden” activists were hankering over the Best Bakery case, several of the 1984 widows ALSO reverted their testimonies and the culprits (in Congress) were set free in that court case.
    None of those activists had either the time or the inclination to even look at that.
    In my book, this boggie of so-called Hindutva is just that.. a smoke-screen. To me the basic character of what you want to refer to is everywhere.. so why associate it with a particular religion? In fact, the plight of Kashmiri Pandits say something totally different! But thats ok, I dont expect any finer thinking from a “paint-everything-with-a-big-brush” kind of a guy.
    From where I see, as the Sikh killings and Gujarat killings and Nandigram killings were no different.. yet Buddhadeb and Rajiv are never spoken of in the same breath as Modi… why?
    You want to talk hard facts eh? So lets discuss ’em! What makes you single out Modi? Lets hear you talk of Communistic and COngress barbarism? Define how Nandigram and Sikh killings were any less evil and deliberately planned than Gujarat riots?
    WHat say.. you have the forum.. go ahead.
    Or if you choose to be selective in your vitriol and amnesic in your anger, then lets not pretend to give it a mask of “intellectual debate”. For then, it is anytihng BUT!
    -desh
    drishtikone.com

33. Your rationale is fragmented. You are not addressing the deeper issues I have brought forth. I, and i guess we all, grew up in a very culturally rich environment in India, trust me, that type of environment you will not find anywhere in the world. This is thanks to the remnants of the relatively ultra-svelte times of ancient Vedic India, which has nonetheless been adulterated over time. So it is not just material development i am talking about. All the jargon and arguments over political parties and crap is really not needed. Forget about indira gandhi, emergency all that elementary crap.
    It’s quite simple you see..Hinduism is the most advanced collection of wisdom that the Earth has been blessed with. It is the duty of Indians to get back to their roots, and polish the shining jewels that lay in the ocean ignored by the masses. Get over this petty Hindu/Muslim/Sikh low-level crap, and start thinking at higher levels.
    Do me a favor, google up “Vymaanika Shaastra” and check out the first link that comes up..it is a thorough manual about building Vimanas written by Rishi Bharadwaja, one of the SaptaRishis (7 sages of ancient india). Please look at the comprehensive nature of the manual. There are rumours that a version of this manual may have been used by the Chinese in their space program after they found it in a Tibetan cave. A little known fella by the name of David Hatcher Childress, considered a real-life Indiana Jones has published some of his research on this. This is just one relatively unknown example of an array of buried treasures which demand a high priority of attention from the government..which could even help us solve practical issues such as alternative energy.
    There should be no doubt that India needs to become a working Hindu-ish country in order to prosper, else your children are going to suffer the stone-age that will be brought in by your Amar Singhs, Sonias, Lalus and Mayawatis..these guys are the real communal wolves who are spreading irrational emotions of victimisation among their vote-banks of dalits and other minorities.
    Only the most deluded ones will find secularism in the morons of the UPA.

34. Well, before I sign off and stop adding to this discussion that doesn’t seem to be heading anywhere, let me make a couple of quick points.
    One, as far as I’m concerned this is purely a political discussion based on political views and understanding of things. No intellectual pretensions here, sorry.
    Second, while agreeing that the anti-Sikh riots in 84 was as evil as many of the RSS-sponsored riots elsewhere, I should say that it was more of an aberration than anything else in the history of Congress. of course, the attempt is not to exonerate Congress from its role in the 84 riots or the soft-hindutva stands it has taken from time to time, but to put things in perspective. So is the case of Nandigram.
    Nandigram probably is the only instance where the Left in India got blood on their hands. In contrast, the Sangh and its affiliates have been sponsoring riots and hate-campaigns against the minorities in different parts of India for the last so many decades. The records are out there in the public domain — the Net, our newspapers and magazines — for everyone to see and understand.

35. Another Indo-US deal moves forward: Indian workers can get Social Security money back
    http://www.indianexpress.com/story/332763.html
    Over $1 billion contributed to Social Security by part-time Indian workers can get refunded after 3 years
    Very Interesting story and some comments:
    http://www.indianexpress.com/comments/332763.html
    Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh took greatest risk by signing nuclear deal. Now its US President George W. Bush’ turn to show the appreciation. Indian Media and politics MUST follow this in the interest of its talent and contributions. Thank You Indian Express and please follow up to make sure for the results

36. @Abhi
    The problem is people like you conveniently ignore the hard facts that are presented to them just to preserve their own egotistical arguments. For example, you never said anything much about the 36,289 Kashmiri pandits who were killed as of 2003. And I quote Mr. K P S Gill:
    “Since late 1989, the Indian State of Jammu and Kashmir (J&K) has been in the grip of a vicious movement of Islamist extremist terrorism. As many as 36,289 [till December 30, 2003] lives have been lost in this conflict over nearly 14 years of a sub-conventional war that has inflicted enormous suffering on the people of the State, and transformed this confrontation between South Asia’s traditional rivals into a potential nuclear flashpoint.”
    Among the worst victims of this conflict are the Kashmiri Pandits, descendents of Hindu priests and among the original inhabitants of the Kashmir Valley, with a recorded history of over 5,000 years. Over the millennia, this community has been integral not only to the cultural and intellectual life of the people of this region, but the bulwark of its administration and economic development as well. The Pandits have now become the targets and victims of one of the most successful, though little-known, campaigns of ethnic cleansing in the world. Pogroms of a far lesser magnitude in other parts of the world have attracted international attention, censure and action in support of the victim communities, but this is an insidious campaign that has passed virtually unnoticed, and on which the world remains silent. Among the complex reasons for this neglect is, perhaps, the nature of this community itself: where other campaigns of ethnic cleansing have invariably provoked at least some retaliatory violence, the deep tradition and culture of non-violence among the Kashmiri Pandits has made them accept their suffering in silence, with not a single act of retaliatory violence on record.
    “Ethnic cleansing was evidently a systematic component of the terrorists’ strategic agenda in J&K, and estimates suggest that, just between February and March 1990, 140,000 to 160,000 Pandits had fled the Kashmir Valley to Jammu, Delhi, or other parts of the country. Simultaneously, there were a number of high-profile killings of senior Hindu officials, intellectuals and prominent personalities. Eventually, an estimated 400,000 Pandits – over 95 per cent of their original population in the Valley – became part of the neglected statistic of ‘internal refugees’ who were pushed out of their homes as a result of this campaign of terror. Not only did the Indian state fail to protect them in their homes, successive governments have provided little more than minimal humanitarian relief, and this exiled community seldom features in the discourse on the ‘Kashmir issue’ and its resolution.”
    Please google up “The Kashmiri Pandits: An Ethnic Cleansing the World Forgot” to read the entire article full of hard facts.
    If this occurrence does not do anything to far outweigh any other grievances you have towards the Sangh Pariwar and BJP, you are a lost person. No other act of injustice comes close to this amount of passivity on the part of the pseudo-secular people like you who have no sense of balance and are blinded by a sense of deluded do-goodership. This is why Jammu is burning today..and decent Kashmiri Pandits are having to take to the streets with their entire families because their own countrymen have deserted them like this.

37. Leadership? yes we have strong leadership-but great? depends on how we define the term.
    if we go by your definition :’Leadership =Courage =The ability of an individual to get out there and stake everything on what he/she truly believes in.”-well i guess narendra modi would fit in.he is a leader in every sense of th word but the ethicality of his convictions is questionable.
    i would call chandrababu naidu a good leader-but great? not sure.
    somnath chatterjee is my idea of great-but is he a leader? not sure.
    there was a time i believed VP singh was great- he went by his convictions- (bofors, ayodhya and mandal)-but then i began to suspect his motives. but history will give him a place for his landmark mandal decision. back to the question-he is no leader.
    a k antony-he is/was greatin his own way-was a leader too in a limited way-but could not survive-didnt have enough political chicanery.hence not a leader.
    so we have/have had greats. we have/have had leaders. a confluence of greatness & leadership? difficult in a democracy like india’s with its complex pluralistic society.
    and manmohan singh? h is not a leader-but had greatness thrust upon him. he suffered this burden for four years and now appears to have found his footing in the dark world of indian politics. he left the dirty work of garnering support to amar singh, and went ahead with a decision he believed would once and for all subatantially address the energy problem.
    in the peculiar indian context, he is a great leader -in the workshop

38. The problem is dear Hindu brethrens, anything goes wrong in this country we find fault in Hindus. Yes there are flaws. But how long do we appease? Indira Gandhi used Jarnail Singh Bhindranwale and he used her and both complicated the Khalistan issue. It was the Congress trying to use Sikh vote bank. Then lets come to Gujarat. I heard in TV Channel, CNN-IBN which anti-Modi, a Muslim leader appealing Muslims to get over Godhra riot. Muslims burnt 87 Hindu yatris for supporting Ayodhya? (may be these yatris were wrong in supporting Ram Mandir) But was it right to burn them? And what do you expect in return. Even if we believe that it started because a Muslim girl was raped and they burnt 87 yatris for that. 1 woman raped and 87 killed. Still what do you expect? This is a tit-for-tat policy followed by both Hindus and Muslims. But why must only Hindus appologise? Because the CM was a Hindu? He was slow in acting may be knowingly, but the fact remains, Hindus died. If you are so concerned about Muslims then why do you not oppose the Communists and Congress for Nandigram and Singur. Those people there are all Muslims.
    It is easy to say forget the history. But can we forget what we have witnessed in our own lifetime? Kashmir. Is your sympathy enough? Today, I an aethist who have for 28 years said she does not believe in religion and caste system say, I am proud to be a Hindu. Though I still do not believe in God but I am proud that my religion is the most secular. But enough of appeasement. I am not saying kill Muslims. I am saying do not oppose them. If they run a Madarsa, its their religious right, so is Haj. But Amarnath which is one of our char-dham yatra must be shortened to 15 days because it is disturbing Kashmir ecology is what the Hurriyats and PDP are saying. Building temorary huts and toilets is a BIG NO. HINDUS are welcome. What kind of statement are these. You clapped when in ‘Chak De’ the Northeast girls condemned Sukhlal for saying ‘Welcome’ why be different for Hindus in Kashmir? Why should we be welcomed in Kashmir? It is our land. India is the only country for Hindus. I am not asking people to wear saffron band but stop appeasing!!! Today, as a Hindu I am scared!!! I need to apologise to Muslims for letting them in and being a citizen of this great land. And why foorget the Ladhakis? They are with Jammu.
    Coming to the nuclear deal can someone explain the ‘RUSH’? Rush for 25% of civil energy that India will have only by 2050, hoping things will go right that too at a time when Australia, the largest Uranium deposit country has so far not committed to giving us uranium. Having ourselves the largest Thorium deposit, we do not want to invest in that. If one thinks it will benefit us. Then ok please, just check our status in Iran-Pakistan-India gas pipeline and see what a mockery we have become for trusting Iran even after signing deal. And not to forget China, who cheat usat every step with Sikkim, where they just visited, Arunachal Pradesh, parts of Himachal Pradesh, and Kashmir. And all this Congress sarkar does is to appease.

39. When people ask you to read Veda do not take it as just a religious persecution!!! These books have wealth in them that needs to be un-earthed. We refused to study Vedic Maths, and see the Americans have adopted it. Whether you call them Hindu or India, but these books are the basis of Hinduism and are great ones. Those who have a caste problem please raise you rhand if you have feasted with the dalits or even your apartment’s jamadar; do you not have a separate cup for your maid? Please lets not talk big unless you follow it. There you will quote the hygine issue. And thats exactly what the upper castes have been doing. But u are a hygine concious and they are freaks. What do u expect, these upper castes go and clean their houses? If yes, then dear why do you not start the process. By the way how many of you are married to lower castes?
    I support caste base reservation. How many of you do? Caste system exist every where, in every religion…. why blame Hindus alone? The world is divided and will be divided, should we Hindus apologise to everyone? May the Kurds, the Hazaras…..
    Listen, this is the only Hindu country… we cannot allow religious persecution, else our religion will be gone one day. What you see is a defensive reaction to the religious persecution we have been tolerating for 900 years.
    I heard this Zakir Naik on Peace TV saying that Prophet was Kalki!!! Can you believe it? Though I do not believe in God, but I know Purana says with kalki the kalyug end. It is same as Judgement Day, or Qayamt or Maitreya Buddhist… Should we forget him because we are secular? But why? Will they? Is it right of them to attack our religion to prove we are be-din and their religion is the greatest?
    I love Urdu. Love Ghalib, Zafar and Faiz. I am not asking them to love Shankaracharya. I am asking them not to laugh at us because we are idol-worshippers. The way their faith is represented in a book ours is in the idols. Faith is intangible that needs to be represented into a tangible book or idol.

40. Im not from India, not directly anyway. I am from Fiji, small island nation in the Pacific where Indians were taken by the Raj to serve the indenture system.
    We are currently under military rule (again!!!) and yes I agree totally that the inherent assumptions of quality leadership, so entrenched in democracy, are giving us these problems. We must start advertising cabinet positions to attract capable persons in each industry/field – and divise the system with checks and balances – and still deliver democratic rule.
    I always admire India for being the largest democracy and still to under-go a severe constitutional crisis – times are changing I guess!

41. Hey I do agree to most of the part of what you have mentioned, just that before stating ‘I for one applaud Manmohan Singh’s decision to go ahead with the Nuclear Treaty and stake everything on it. It’s what he believes in.’
    Just one question….Are you aware of all the clauses of the Nuclear Treaty.?
    Please try answer this question of mine.

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